Peter, tail and toe nipping is common in young dragons, sometimes a little unavoidable.

I know of a beardie who has no legs, but only 'stubs' who eats, basks, sleeps and drinks fine. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but please don't encourage this person to have it PTS, especially when there is a home waiting right here for it. I guarantee 6 months in my care and you would not think it is the same animal. I would have probably thought the same thing as you before I was a herp keeper but the fact is from an enthuastic rep keeper that animals like this can and do lead normal lives. No different from a dog or cat living with only 3 legs.

In my opinion the only responsibilty keepers and breeders should have is looking after what they produce. If any animal bred by me had birth defects I would keep them - simple as. Unfortunately breeders find it hard to avoid tail and toe nipping because beardies lay so many eggs - it's impossible to seperate all of them. You say these animals would not survive in nature; firstly, when is a glass tank nature? You defy the laws of nature as soon as you put these animals into small manmade glass boxes for our oggling pleasure. These 'defect' animals are produced to a far lesser extent in the wild - so the problem is caused by captive breeding, and therefore, your responsibility to give the animal produced as normal life possible, not take the 'easy' option out and kill them. Animals are not disposable.

I think their is a huge responsibility on breeders to not breed defect animals and to cull them as to not make an abnormality "a norm".

When I said the animals wouldn't survive in nature I was talking about natural selection in "the wild" and the strong and healthy surviving while the weak will not live to the point of which they'd be able to re-create (ensuring only the blood and dna pools are from the best specimens are preserved)

"If any animal bred by me had birth defects I would keep them - simple as." << This point I can sympathise with if you spawn imperfect specimens and keep them then yourself as you can make sure they don't have the opportunity to breed and re-create. I know we all have a soft spot for those born abnormal (hell the elephant man even got his own movie!)

But to fob them off on someone else who isn't an experienced keeper, to me this is the pisstake. If you talk to any breeder worth their salt, they wouldn't ever let any specimen showing any imperfections leave their care.

I never said keeping any animal in a glass tank was natural. This is even more reason why as keepers and breeders it is our responsiblity to replicate their environment to the best of our ability and we have to play the hand of God as the food chain and the course of nature cannot naturally take place. Hence it is on us to cull the weak and keep the best gene pools and only breed from the healthiest specimens that are free from defect.

Your correct less defect animals are bred in nature, but the reason for this is the weak and defect specimens die generally before they reach breeding age. The reason for a massive increase in defect born animals in care comparison to those born naturally/in the wild etc. Is not because of the conditions they are kept in artifically (by us the keepers) but more so because certain keepers apply the logic you are using. Ie: Don't cull the weak, let them live etc.

I hope you do take it Jess and I hope you do get it on the mend and as healthy as it can be. I'm not trying to sound evil and say kill kill kill. My issue isn't with a kind hearted animal lover like yourself trying to do a good deed. Its with the riff raff who pass on such specimens to inexperienced keepers like Dillon (thats not meant to cause offense by the way Dillon.) When I say inexperienced I don't mean an ignorant keeper but more so your average reptile keeper as opposed to someone like Jess who is a walking reptile/spider guru

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Team Geophagus - Go Geophagus or go home

ive got a 1 eyed spitting cobra you can cuddle anytime ya want jess! sorry couldnt resist

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WHO'S YA DADDY

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Baby Bristlenose plec's avalable soon! pm if you want to be added to my list

LOL Terrence! She'll probably bite it off

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Team Geophagus - Go Geophagus or go home

Thanks for all your replies guys, i have taken a bit of time to really read up on Crip's (as he is now known) needs.

I have gotten him into a routine of eating crickets from a tub i lay down - he sticks his head in and has them cornered! Im making sure that they are frosted in vitamin suppliments and have printed off a food table to ensure that he is getting the right veg's too.

Since i have been doing this he hasnt had an episode where he stiffs up on his side or back.

I have provided a 2nd basking area for him too - the other beardie seems to be leaving him alone a lot more now - maybe becuase i take him out so Crip can eat

I dont know if this will cure him in the long run or not but he seems to be doing better