Home Adverts Recent Added Auction Scam Alerts Forum List Your Ad ShopAds Videos Directory Tropical Fish Aquariums & Equip Marine Fish & Marine Inverts Cichlids Malawi Tanganyikan Cichlids Wanted Discus Goldfish, Koi & Ponds Retailers & Services ALL ADS By County    Home      Reply     Viewed: 702 -- Replies: 64 PM | All Topics | General | Cichlids | Marine | Coldwater | Tanks/Equipment | Diseases | Members Posted should salt be added to a malawi tank? 06-07-2006 18:39 by seawolf hi yes i'm back the reason i'm starting this thread is yesterday in (ad should be band ), i mentioned i put salt in my tank to witch i got many varied remarks and also my water quality maybe inadequet. as the webmaster and you all pointed out i should do some reading , so i did and tried http://www.malawicichlidhomepage.com/index.HTML before we start this debate i would like to add this is marine salt in my tank not on your chips type. an article on there by FRANCESCO ZEZZA is about the ph values of lake malawi and if you do the average it is 7.9-8 exactly as i stated yesturday another article was by GEORGE J RECLOS - how to make salt for your tank , this is on a malawi web site . as you read in the article he tells you the chemical required in order of importance to make the salt witch if you read the back of any box of marine salt will give you. this is not to have ago or say people are wrong , as this forum is here to educate people not put people down. 06-07-2006 18:56 by trik hi there sea wolf im sure you will get alot of replies after yesterday , good luck . richard 06-07-2006 18:59 by seawolf hi trik yes i'm sure your right ! 06-07-2006 18:59 by deejdave THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO TRACE OF SODIUM SALTS IN THE AFRICAN RIFT LAKES. You can buy so called cichlid salts which are a mixture of water hardners, minerals and buffers but they are in no way related to sea salt. 06-07-2006 19:01 by rob r i had a disease in my tank tried all midicines no good then i added tonic salt fish recovered great i think it was the extra oxygen produced along with other salt benefits 06-07-2006 19:02 by seawolf hi there did you read the site i put up as it did mention NaCL whitch in laymans terms is SODIUM CHLORIDE 06-07-2006 19:06 by deejdave I dont care what your site says, speak to someone who is a researcher at Lake Malawi and ask them how much salt is in the water... 06-07-2006 19:07 by seawolf PS , THERE IS ALSO NaHCO3 which is sodium bicarbonate 06-07-2006 19:08 by rob r deejdave it perked mine up no end 06-07-2006 19:12 by seawolf its not my site , i dont own it ,run it ,or speak on it. and it was people on here ask me to read it because of my lack of knowledge 06-07-2006 19:12 by deejdave Ok for a short term fix but in the long term can cause internal damage and gill damage, as these fish do not naturally come in to contact with salt their bodies are not designed to deal with it. Normally after a treatment the salt would be diluted away with watrer changes but regularly adding sea salt can cause aforementioned problems. Quite simply, buy "Salt" for african cichlids, not for sea creatures. It isnt difficult and these products arent made just for a laugh. 06-07-2006 19:13 by steve gast lets calm this down 06-07-2006 19:14 by deejdave Its like buying a dog and feeding it hamster food... 06-07-2006 19:14 by steve gast "Quite simply, buy "Salt" for african cichlids, not for sea creatures" salt for african cichlids? buy in what quantity Dave? 06-07-2006 19:14 by paul stevens Rob r dont waste ya breath mate years ago there was none of these money spinning cemicals around we just used some salt. Wait for it... 06-07-2006 19:15 by deejdave Seachem liquids maybe? Treat thousands of litres per bottle. 06-07-2006 19:15 by deejdave I just dont understand people who buy things they dont know how to look after and then buy the wrong things. If you keep Africans, buy additives FOR AFRICANS. 06-07-2006 19:16 by deejdave Probably doesnt work out any more expensive than buying a decent sea salt and you know that its right. 06-07-2006 19:18 by steve gast i am lost here, Dave are you saying to buy regular salt for African Cichlids? "Quite simply, buy "Salt" for african cichlids" if so how much to use? not sure..... 06-07-2006 19:18 by steve gast or you mean any box that mentions salt and african cichlids in one??? but i agree all a big rip off, 06-07-2006 19:28 by paul stevens So seawolf did you get the answer you was expecting. 06-07-2006 19:29 by paul stevens If you want to ask anything els seawolf speak to Big Rob hes the man... 06-07-2006 19:35 by seawolf i didn't realy expect an answer as every one is diffrent. people tell you to ask the experts , so you do and they dont like the reply ! this was not ment as having a go it was to educate. the for mentioned ph was take from the lake in question , and the chemical breakdown was from an malawi web sight given to me by the web master . 06-07-2006 19:54 by nige one of the tricks i have used for years is adding sodium bicarbonate to the water it will not raise the ph abouve 8.2 so you can add as much as you want (in theory anyway)as this will increase your tempory hardness (kh). the problem with nacl2 is that is is always found in a + ion form so adding to this will increase the ionic content of the water which in turn increases the conductivity and your fish are not designed to cope with that sort of conductivity in the water which can and probably will eventually end up with heart and kidney failure. ok m8 not having a dig, but i thought i would inform a few people on here exactly what salt does when disolved in water 06-07-2006 19:56 by nige also sorry for my poor grammar,sentence structure and punctuation peace out. nige 06-07-2006 19:59 by rob r as i stated earlier i lost a lot of fish till i used salt it worked on trops. i and a lot of people i know use it on pondfish also with no visible detrimental effects whatsoever.as has been said earlier individuals choice .seawolf you know how to start a debatable thread 06-07-2006 20:02 by seawolf thank for the insight in to this debate its much welcome but the salt makeup requires NaHCO3 SODIUM BICARBONATE according to the article NaCL is sodium chloride , i'm no chemist so article may be wrong ! 06-07-2006 20:07 by tony mcculloch hello again seawolf. you dont need to add salt to your malawi tank, its not naturaly needed and the majority of people use it regular to ward of whitespot etc. I am very lucky as my tap water is ideal for keeping African cichlids, but if your ph levels are low, then people do use the bicarb soda to bring there levels up, but with regards to putting as much as you want in, well, not sure about that. wymcot uses bicarb of some description. 06-07-2006 20:11 by paul stevens Now tony thats about the best reply ive seen that is all that was needed. 06-07-2006 20:17 by seawolf hi tony in yesterdays article i said i put in i teaspoon per gallon which if tested on a hydrometer does not even move the neddle and mine starts at 1000 gravity which is fresh water. im well aware that if you put fresh water fish into the ocean the salt will collect in the kidneys and kill the fish, as salt water fish will absorb to much water. my ph levels are fine as i have put ocean rock and coral gravel to buffer that effect. 06-07-2006 20:23 by steve gast paul stevens you are like the woman in the house of commons you dont actually contribute you just keep order with the occasional post 06-07-2006 20:26 by steve gast wife is changing? are you? 06-07-2006 20:28 by paul stevens 06-07-2006 20:33 by nige hold on seawolf 1000g is pure wate e.g. distilled or reverse osmosis water. i think your hydrometer may be out of wack m8 as even out of the tap you shoud measure some difference 06-07-2006 20:40 by seawolf hi there fresh is 1000 , salt is 1025 it takes approxamatly 35 teaspoons of salt to get past 1020 in a gallon of water , and of the shelf hydrometers are not accurate enough to tell the diffrence . and u r correct ro/ filtered water can be less than 1000 a litre but this is taken as untampered tap water. 06-07-2006 20:52 by nige it should be exactly 1000 it is imposible for it to be below anyway. *scurrys back under rock* 06-07-2006 21:15 by seawolf hi this has been a good debate , one thing for certain it has raised a lot of questions . good idea this forum. will be back carl 06-07-2006 22:00 by wymcot Guys - All I use in my tamk during every water change (which for Malawi's should be 25% min / week)is bicarbonate of soda to raise the KH (carbonate hardness). This in turn raises PH so a PH of say 8.2 will result in a KH of around 18 dgh (Degree's of German Hardnesss). Similary, to raise the GH (General Hardness)I use Epsom Salts and I work on a level of approx 18-20 dgh. An optional which I use is Kent Chiclid Essentials which add some trace elements but this is not really necessary. Before adding anything to your tank you need to test your tap water and/or tank water. Bicarb should be added slowly as it will quickly raise the ph, this should not increase by more than 0.3 is a 24hr period as any more can shock the fish. Epsom Salts do not effect PH but again they should be added gradually. Once the KH, GH & PH levels are obtained the water will be buffered so a 25% water change will have little effect on these parameters. In my case 25% equates to over 200ltrs so I tend to top up at every change. If anyone wants further advise on how to do this, just ask, its not brain science but can appear confusing to the unititiated 06-07-2006 22:05 by tony mcculloch It wont be the ocean rock that is affecting your ph, unless you are confusing with tuffa rock, if not, then it will be the coral gravel. have you taested the ph from your tap water? it obviously isn't a problem for you, but nice to know for sure, incase you decide to do away with the rock, or gravel in the future. 06-07-2006 22:08 by tony mcculloch sorry wymcot, didnt see that coming LOL AND WYMCOT, THE ROCK IS STILL FINE!!! 06-07-2006 22:10 by steve gast rock is fine 06-07-2006 22:11 by steve gast didnt see you coming tony 06-07-2006 22:15 by steve gast ROCK IS FINE 06-07-2006 23:15 by nige *sniff sniff* hmm multiple posts........... me thinks me smells a lexter!!!! 06-07-2006 23:17 by rob r i wondered but i can make sense of lexters posts 06-07-2006 23:21 by nige maybe a lexter on the sauce? i dunno. no offence if your not but it wouldnt be normal without someone pointing the finger in an essay of a thread like this 07-07-2006 07:39 by seawolf hi there if you read the advert you would have seen i live in north devon does lexter ? 07-07-2006 10:48 by nige i wasnt refering to you seawolf, it was aimed a "steve gast" 07-07-2006 12:00 by seawolf except my 1000 appologies nige 07-07-2006 12:18 by rob r nige just beat me 07-07-2006 12:35 by trik GTP more like 07-07-2006 12:36 by rob r yep 07-07-2006 12:43 by Lexter Nige - not too sure about you taking my name in vain mate, you see the confusion it can cause. Am not annoyed - your post made just larf out loud, especially about "lexter on the sauce" if you gonna take the lords name in vain let me know first coz i maybe able to set you straight befire you start a load of rumours nige 07-07-2006 12:45 by Lexter and also Nige, if you persist on spreading rumours about Lexter and his alcoholism i will have no choice but to set Rob R on you and you have to think about this...... do you REALLY want a 6foot 7inch beast of a hairy man dressed up in stockings and suspenders coming to your front door, coz i tell ya, all it takes is for me to have a quiet word in Robs ear and he will do it 07-07-2006 12:50 by rob r 07-07-2006 17:37 by nige NOOOOOO not rob r!!!!!! 07-07-2006 17:37 by nige the multiple posts before someone else can get a word in i mean 07-07-2006 17:37 by nige Lol.... not meant to cause offence, its just one of your excelent charactaristics......... 07-07-2006 17:51 by rob r whoops there goes a garter belt 07-07-2006 17:52 by Lexter i forgive you my dear Nigel i will have to keep rob r on a short leash as he was looking forward to getting all "kitted up" and paying you a visit 07-07-2006 17:56 by rob r and i was getting out my rubber pantyhose 07-07-2006 19:29 by Lexter dont worry rob r, the next person to cross me will get the full Roberto Rodriquez treatment 07-07-2006 19:33 by rob r first find out if tights or stockings are preffered 07-07-2006 19:37 by Lexter 07-07-2006 20:28 by telboy always gotta be stockings mate,pref'white! 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